Can I Have a VBAC After Multiple C-Sections?

Today Petra joins me on Motherhood Flow, to share her four birth stories including a VBA3C (VBAC after three c-sections). She is a voice demanding change in childbirth advocacy.  Each insight shared in our conversation serves as a call to action, encouraging mothers to stand firm in their birthing choices and to seek out informed consent as a fundamental right. This episode is more than a conversation; it's a testament to the power of true informed choice.

Petra is the host of The VBAC Junkie Podcast and she also extends a hand to those considering their own VBAC journey.

Petra's Website
Petra's Instagram
The VBAC Junkie Podcast

Transcript

Hannah Gill: 0:01

Hello everyone, it has been a hot second since I released an episode. Like I said in the previous episode, I was on a little bit of a hiatus, trying to take a break, refocus, refigure out what I'm doing as far as life and business.

Hannah Gill: 0:20

It is April, so it is now cesarean awareness month, which is very near and dear to my heart, as most of you may know, being a C-section and a VBAC mom. And today's episode is actually going to be a VBAC story. It is my friend, petra, and she had a VBAC after three C-sections, which I know many, many women ask about. About having VBACs after multiple C-sections, which I know many, many women ask about, about having VBACs after multiple C-sections. And to tell you a little bit about Petra, she is a full spectrum doula, a supporter of physiological birth, a catalyst for VBAC, a VBAC after three C-section mom and a crusader in unveiling the business of hospital birth. We have been friends for almost two years now. We met virtually via a birth worker program that we were both in and she is absolutely wonderful. So please get ready to welcome Petra. I'm your host, hannah Gill, and this is Motherhood Flow. All right, hi, petra, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for being here.

Petra Cruz: 1:43

Absolutely. I'm so honored to be here. I love your show. I'm an avid listener and I just love everything that you do. What it's true.

Hannah Gill: 1:58

She sounded so I'm going to have to be on my blooper. That's going to be at the end of the episode on my blooper.

Petra Cruz: 2:06

Okay.

Hannah Gill: 2:09

Okay, petra, would you like to get started with telling all of your birth stories and in whatever capacity you feel comfortable doing so? For those of you that don't know, petra had to be back after three C-sections, so she will go over her birth stories for that feedback after three C-sections.

Petra Cruz: 2:25

So she will go over her birth stories for that. Yeah, absolutely so. When I first got pregnant, first of all, I was a teen mom. I was actually 16 years old. So I just kind of trusted that my body would know what to do and I didn't prepare whatsoever. I mean, absolutely, our bodies know what to do, but I didn't account for the fact that I would be kind of bullied in the hospital and the medical system. So I was coerced into having a C-section, which I didn't realize at the time. But the words your baby could die were thrown around and that's all I heard. So I accepted the C-section and it was horrible.

Petra Cruz: 3:06

I didn't see my baby until she was wrapped up in I don't even know how many blankets and you can only see like the circle of her face. And they brought her to me and was like here's your baby. And I was just like huh, weird, are you sure? Like I don't even. It just felt so disconnecting, like I didn't feel like it was my child and it was so weird. And so I was like cold and I felt so drugged up and my arms were strapped down and it was just, I don't know. I felt like this weird, like prisoner and like I couldn't do anything and of course I love my baby Like she was absolutely incredible. She's almost 19 now, which is weird to say, but so, yeah, it was really hard postpartum to heal from that.

Petra Cruz: 3:50

And let's fast forward to 10 years later. I got pregnant with my second daughter and I had a partial placenta previa. That was diagnosed at a 20 week ultrasound and I had no idea that actually like a partial placenta previa, so if you're not familiar, it's where your placenta is partially covering the opening of your cervix, so it can be very dangerous. But I didn't realize it could move. It could actually move out of the way as your uterus stretches and grows. So I was automatically scheduled for a C-section and I did. At about 35 weeks I had a little like literally drops of blood, like nothing crazy, literally like a couple drops, and I let my provider know and she's like, oh my gosh, we got to schedule you for a C-section like ASAP. So 36 weeks I was scheduled for a C-section because I didn't research, I didn't know any better, and had my second C-section my baby at 36 weeks.

Petra Cruz: 4:42

I was scheduled for a C-section because I didn't research, I didn't know any better and had my second C-section my baby at 36 weeks and it was horrible. It was the same thing so cold and just so much disconnection from my baby, and I didn't feel a part of the process at all. It just felt like everything was done to me. They were talking about their weekend plans while they're, you know, doing this surgery on me and I don't know. I just felt like I don't know, like it wasn't my body. I couldn't make any decisions over what was happening to me and because that's what they said was best for me at that time, that was such an early C-section too.

Petra Cruz: 5:23

Yeah, and I didn't realize it how early it was. You know, I just thought well, the doctor must know this is the safest option. But when I was planning my VBAC I actually went back and got my medical records and they did an ultrasound that day of my C-section and my placenta was nowhere in the way of my cervix. But they never told me that.

Hannah Gill: 5:45

They never even told you like you said. You didn't know it could move and they never counseled you on that.

Petra Cruz: 5:52

No, and it's because the specific hospital that that doctor could attend they had you know what's called the VBAC ban, so they didn't allow VBACs. I know it's so ridiculous. So I had actually told her I wanted a VBAC, but she was like, oh, absolutely not, like we don't do that here, and so I don't know. There was just so many situations and conversations that we had where I felt so defeated and I was just like I guess this is my only option.

Hannah Gill: 6:18

What year was that? What year was that C-section done?

Petra Cruz: 6:20

The second C-section was 2015.

Hannah Gill: 6:24

See, that's not even that long ago I was thinking that maybe it was after, like all the all the VBACs in the nineties, and then people were being induced and and all of that. So I would understand the fear there of people doing VBACs, but that wasn't that long ago, so that's no.

Petra Cruz: 6:39

I know Wild, absolutely wild. So you know the recovery was rough from there too. Since she was premature, we had a horrible breastfeeding journey. It was really hard and I did end up just kind of thrown in the towel like a couple of weeks after cause it was just so hard healing from a C-section trying to breastfeed. So fast forward again, four years later we decided to have another baby and I didn't realize that I could have a VBAC because everyone kept saying once a C-section, always a C-section, especially after two, like it's so dangerous. My doctor, I remember, told me like there's an 80% chance of my uterus rupturing. And yeah, I know I was like I didn't think about it at the time Like where did you get that information Right?

Hannah Gill: 7:24

Where did that stat come from?

Petra Cruz: 7:25

Yeah, yeah. So I just I scheduled a C-section at 39 weeks and you know I did prepare for that one more. I had like more of a what you would call gentle cesarean. So I had like a clear drape and like there was music playing and I asked them not to talk about like their weekend plans and you know, just let me know what was going on, reassure me the whole time. So I did ask for skin to skin immediately too, but they didn't honor it after all. But still, there was that disconnect. I was like I didn't feel. I felt broken.

Petra Cruz: 8:00

I was like what is wrong with my body, like I can't give birth the way my body was made to. So it was just so, even though it was the best C-section recovery I had out of all of them, because I did plan and prepare for it could be hard, so we did end up breastfeeding for over a year, but it was still really rough.

Hannah Gill: 8:29

It was a rough start. Did you, for any of those births, did you take any like childbirth education classes? Did you have a doula at all or what all did you do? I know you said the first one. You were very, very young so you maybe probably didn't do that, but for any of those did you do anything specifically like to prepare ahead of time?

Petra Cruz: 8:49

No, I mean, the only thing that I did was looked up gentle cesarean for my third. But besides that I had just always heard like the once a C-section, always a C-section, so that kept playing in my head.

Petra Cruz: 9:01

And then also, because I didn't realize I could switch providers, I was like, well, they won't do it, you know, and they know better than I do and a lot of my family's from, like they're in the medical profession, and so I had that in my ear too of like just listen to your doctor, your doctor knows best. Yeah, okay, so now comes where I finally like stood up for myself. So my husband and I decided we wanted to have another baby and there was going to be a two year gap in between them. So I told my husband you know what? I don't want to have another surgery Like this is a major abdominal surgery and he was never able to take off more than like a week from work.

Petra Cruz: 9:43

So I was doing it all alone, you know, and healing from a major surgery which is so hard in itself, but to have to take care of multiple kids and a newborn. So I told him I'm having a VBAC, I don't care what the doctors say, I'm doing all the education, I'm educating myself, I'm learning my rights. And so I did, and I just started out planning my preparation before I even found out I was pregnant. You know, I started with nutrition and started really focusing on movement. Moving my body and nutrition was key for me to start, because I really wanted to have my body like in the best possible shape to prepare, because I had also heard people say about like heavier people can't have VBACs, which I know now is totally not true. Right, but you hear all these things. You know that people just spit into your ear and unless you dive into it you don't know.

Hannah Gill: 10:38

Mm, hmm.

Petra Cruz: 10:39

So I did that. I did once we did. We got pregnant really fast and so I took two birth education courses. One was hypno babies and the other one was like a VBAC specific course, but it wasn't really that much different than like a regular birth education course. So I don't know, for me it didn't really help for VBAC specific and to me I feel like you definitely need VBAC specific things to do, like healing from previous birth trauma.

Petra Cruz: 11:13

I definitely had researched into that, like how to prepare, so I did. I was healing my previous birth trauma, which I didn't even realize I had until I started actually thinking about my previous births and how I was't even realize I had, until I started actually thinking about my previous births and how I was treated, how I was talked to. So that was just one of the aspects. I did fear release because, of course, there's so much fear surrounding VBAC and especially after multiple cesareans.

Petra Cruz: 11:38

So I definitely, like I wrote down all my fears and I actually wrote them on a piece of paper, said them out loud, and then I actually burned them. And then, you know, I actually thought about like those worst case scenarios from those fears, like, ok, if I did rupture, what could happen? Ok. And then I just looked at both sides of it, like what would I do either way? You know, if the worst thing happened, how would I combat that? And I did that with every single fear that I had. And I was like this is not bad. This is not as bad as I thought it could be. There's a solution to everything. There's a different way. We can pivot if need be. So I was still with the same provider at the time, so I knew they were not VBAC supportive. I actually mentioned it to them and they were like, oh my gosh, like that's horrible, like your baby can die, you can die. And I was like I'm doing my research, I understand the risks and I'm doing it, so I'm going to switch providers. And they were like, well, you can do what you want. And I was like, well, I know, thank you.

Petra Cruz: 12:40

So I did switch providers and I switched to Kaiser and where I am it's Kaiser Modesto, california, and they I knew they were VBAC supportive after two C-sections. So I was like, well, I've only had one, more than that, so they should be supportive, right? So I switched, by the time like the whole switching process happened. I was like in the 32nd week of pregnancy or something like that. So I went to my first appointment, told them my plan and they were like, oh no, this is no, we don't recommend this. Like we're going to schedule your repeat C-section. And I was like you can schedule it all you want, but I'm not going to show up. And so they were like, well, okay, I guess we won't schedule it then. And every single appointment after that was I gosh, I don't even know. I saw a different provider every single time. I saw like nurse practitioners, I saw a maternal fetal medicine doctor for high risk women and just everybody. I saw everybody. It was like I think when we came down to it it was like nine providers I saw and it was wild. And so I hired a doula because you know, that's what I read would help or could help. And she was incredible, like she had never supported a VBAC client before. But I felt confident enough in myself, in how I was preparing, that I'd be absolutely fine and I just wanted that extra emotional and physical support during labor. Also, because we have multiple kids, I wanted to make sure that my husband could focus on the kids and I would still be focused on no matter what. So it was incredible Like I'm going to hit the labor part, because that is like my favorite.

Petra Cruz: 14:23

I was so excited to go into labor. Like, as we got closer to my due date I was like, oh my gosh, I can't wait to go into labor. I would wake up every day like this might be. But it was like 39 weeks and five days, I think, and I started getting contractions and I was like, oh my gosh, like this is happening, my body's doing it. And I labored into the night, off and on. It was like not consistent at all. I was like, oh, I better try to fall asleep. Fell asleep and then it was morning time. I was like what they stopped. So I went through that for three more days.

Petra Cruz: 14:57

I had prodromal labor and so that started on a Friday and I had a doctor's appointment for my 40 week appointment that Monday. So I was laboring all through the weekend and I went in and she's like well, I could perform like a cervical sweep if you want. Cause, you're like cause. She did check me and I was like two centimeters and I was like so exhausted Originally I didn't want anything like that but I was like let's get this going because I'm so uncomfortable and I just want to get going. And so she did do the sweep, the membrane sweep, which, after she did it, oh my gosh, my labor was so intense.

Petra Cruz: 15:38

Like it started it and it didn't stop. I had contractions consistently, every like seven to 10 minutes, and so after the appointment we went home and I decided, you know, we were going to labor at home as long as possible until we left for the hospital. Originally I wanted a home birth, but I called all the midwives in my area and they were like no, we can't like, that's risking our license, we can get in big trouble.

Petra Cruz: 16:08

And you know I wasn't very comfortable with having a free birth and my doula absolutely said she could not attend like a free birth. So, you know, I just was like, okay, we'll labor at home as long as possible and then head to the hospital. And so we labored at home and it was beautiful. We were spending time with family. I ate a big nutritious meal because I knew I might not be hungry later in labor, and it was perfect. Like my mom ended up coming over, which wasn't planned at all. She came over, my brother came over, my sister came over. It was like a party, Like everybody came over. It was perfect. They were like feeding me and giving me drinks and my doula ended up coming over when I needed. Like I literally needed hip squeezes for every single contraction Cause I had like crazy back labor and it was weird. Like the labor actually like radiated through my thighs, which I was not expecting. I had never heard of that until.

Petra Cruz: 17:04

I experienced it and I was like this is crazy, I need something, every single contraction. But it did help those hip squeezes, oh my gosh. So we just went through the day and it was like five o'clock at night, I think, and my labor started at 9 am. So this was nine until like five, and then I sat on the toilet and then all of a sudden I started shaking. I was like uncontrollably shaking and I was like my doula. I said to my doula am I cold? I don't feel cold. Is it cold in here? And she was like you're hitting transition, like okay, just give into it. And then it was like once she said that it was like a trigger to my brain and I just like instantly, like felt the tension release from my body.

Hannah Gill: 17:50

I was.

Petra Cruz: 17:50

I was like not understanding what was happening, and so once I did like just relax and let it happen, then it was fine. It didn't feel as like. It didn't feel horrible or weird. I was just like, okay, my body's in labor, going through transition. And then after that, though, I could hear like maybe we should go to the hospital, like is it time for us to leave? And I heard that and I was like no, because like I secretly did want a home birth, you know like right it right what just happened.

Petra Cruz: 18:20

But no, we ended up leaving for the hospital like 30 minutes later and so I think we got to the hospital it was like 6 or 6, 30 somewhere in that at night and we got into triage and of course you know they want to do all the checks on you and blah, blah, blah, which you, which you know, at that moment I was flowing through labor so amazingly, like the contractions were bearable, like I was laughing and talking between contractions, like it was incredible. Honestly, the hypno babies, I feel like, was so incredibly helpful, like that really helped me like just zone into what I was doing. So I got checked and when they did check me, I was like I can't remember what the doctor said at nine or 10 centimeters, and I was like when I heard that I was like oh my gosh you were there, yeah.

Petra Cruz: 19:11

But I didn't realize he was like a student or a resident. And so there was another doctor that came in behind him and was like, well, I got to check and make sure because he's like a student. So we and I was like what, what? Like if I would have known that I wouldn't have even let him check me, cause I don't want to be checked again.

Hannah Gill: 19:27

Right.

Petra Cruz: 19:28

And I didn't realize at that time, I could literally say no and be like no more, you know but, he was like super, he was kind of pushy about it.

Petra Cruz: 19:38

And so I was like, okay, whatever, just do it quick. And then so he did the check and he was like, oh, I'd say you're more, like eight, eight and a half. And I was like, oh my gosh, you're so ridiculous, You're half centimeter, whatever. And then I did have like a bulging bag and he's like, oh, I could break it right now. And I was like, no, no, no, it's okay, Like just leave it. And then he goes, oh, your baby has a small head. And I was just like, oh my gosh, get your hand out of me. Like what?

Petra Cruz: 20:03

are you like, oh, so that kind of messed up my flow a little bit, and but then when we did get into the room, I had an amazing nurse that was assigned to me for my whole birth and she was just like whatever you want to do, like let's do it. And everybody was so like supportive. I was expecting to put up a fight because of all you know, everybody that I talked to in my appointments were like no, no, no, no, no, we don't do that. And so, since everybody was so supportive, I felt like I could relax because they were like, have a baby, let's do this, you're doing this. And I was like, oh yeah. Because they were like, have a baby, let's do this, you're doing this. And I was like, oh yeah.

Petra Cruz: 20:47

So I was laboring in the room and I did get like the Aileen lock, so I didn't actually have any fluids going through me, but I just had the lock and then I was being monitored. So you know, I was kind of restricted to around the bed moving, but I mostly wanted to be in hands and knees anyways. So you know, it was fine on the bed and then, I don't know, we were just flowing through labor once we got settled in the room and it was like I don't know 8.30, almost nine o'clock at night and I was like I feel like I cannot get comfortable. I felt like I was climbing the walls for a second. I was like okay, something needs to happen. And all of a sudden I was like I need to go to the bathroom. I think I'm going to poop. And they're like I don't know if you got a poop. And they were like can I check? And I was like sure, and so I flipped over and she didn't even like put her hand inside me or anything.

Hannah Gill: 21:33

She was like oh yeah you're having a baby right now.

Petra Cruz: 21:36

I was like, oh, thank God, and so I did want to stay in like the all fours position or a squatting position, but they couldn't find a squat bar. I was so annoyed. I was like, oh my gosh, so tip to anybody, like if you feel like you want to even try a squat position on the bed, or if you're having an epidural ask for that squat bar, like before you even want it, because not all hospitals have them for every single bed.

Petra Cruz: 22:03

It's crazy yeah so, anyways, I was in like a semi sitting position, like a throne position. There you go and they have these weird handles on the side of the bed. You feel like you're in a roller coaster ride or something. So I was like holding on to these handles to like help brace myself to push and I pushed like five times and then he like flew out.

Hannah Gill: 22:28

Yeah.

Petra Cruz: 22:28

Like we almost didn't catch him because he was all like bloody and slippery and slimy too. I was like oh my gosh. And so, like you know, they're like, oh my God, put your hands down there, like your baby's right there. And so I grabbed him and pulled him up and it was just like oh my gosh, I was just so overwhelmed with emotion, I was like crying, I was laughing, I was like, oh my God, I did it, like I seriously did it, and everybody was like clapping and they were just like, oh my gosh, you did so good.

Petra Cruz: 22:58

And I was just in bliss land after that. I didn't know about what, anything was happening around me. I was just so. You know that oxytocin dump you get after birth is real, and my plan was to just go unmedicated the whole time because, in case I felt something weird, like my uterus possibly you know something weird with that I wanted to be able to feel it and be able to tell them if something didn't feel right, and so I never even thought about like medication at all the entire time Cause it just felt so like manageable and I felt like I could do it for another 12 hours, like it didn't feel like I thought it might at all.

Petra Cruz: 23:40

So, yeah, it was incredible. So I was able to like I didn't need anything since I didn't have fluids. They said, oh yeah, you can leave in like 24 hours and as long as all your tests are good and everything. So it was like so blissful there, even though it's annoying to be in the hospital because of all the beeping, all the people coming in every five seconds. I was in this like high. It is like the craziest high you ever feel without being on actual drugs, it's true, yeah, so it was perfect and like he latched right away and, to be honest, he's like going to be two in like a month and we're still breastfeeding. So I didn't anticipate like going this long, but here we are.

Hannah Gill: 24:26

Yeah, yeah.

Petra Cruz: 24:27

It's been awesome.

Hannah Gill: 24:29

So, as far as I cause, I want women to know this specifically so many people. Obviously having a supportive provider is going to be like your best chance at like having a VBAC, but you clearly did that after three C-sections without a supportive provider. So what do you think like your best advice to women would be if they don't have a supportive provider? If you are preparing for a VBAC, I have put together a free guide to help you in your preparation. If you are preparing for a VBAC, I have put together a free guide to help you in your preparation. It's called preparing for a VBAC your first three steps to an empowered birth experience. This guide will walk you through the first three steps that you need to make on your VBAC preparation journey and it'll make the whole process a lot easier and more straightforward for you. So if you want to grab that guide, go to thehannagillcom forward slash first steps.

Petra Cruz: 25:22

Again, that is thehannagillcom forward slash first steps and say it was easy, because I would leave my appointments sometimes, almost every time, crying and wondering if I was doing the right thing, because everyone kept saying I wasn't. So you know, the best advice I would say is do your research, know the actual numbers, the risks, and decide whether you're okay with that and learn how to advocate for yourself. Whether you're okay with that and learn how to advocate for yourself. Learn your rights, because we have more rights than we realize. Like, ultimately, this is your baby, this is your body. Nobody can force you to do anything that you don't want to do. So, yeah, do what feels right to you.

Hannah Gill: 26:15

And I feel like that's such a big thing. It's especially for, like I'm a people pleaser too, you like you don't want to have confrontation, you don't want to fight with people, you don't want to stand up for yourself, and this is the time in life where, like more than anything, we should be. It's like our. It's our birth experience and our baby's birth experience. So, knowing that you can say no and it's okay, like fight with people if you need to like stand up for yourself, yeah.

Petra Cruz: 26:43

Yeah, absolutely. And like I tell people too, I'm a recovering people pleaser. I hate when people are mad at me, I hate when people like don't like me. And you know that was really hard to overcome because, like I said before, I have a lot of family in the medical field. So we've always been taught like, like you listen to authority figures, you listen to your doctor, and so that was a hard hurdle to get over. But you know, with that you really have to look into yourself and do that inner work, because, even if it's like, it's not just for your birth, it's for your life after that too, because once your baby is born, you still have to be an advocate for them. So not only yourself but your baby, to make sure that your baby has, you know, autonomy, because so many people just treat babies like whatever we say is right, yeah, but you know I don't know. So it's important not just for your birth but for after.

Hannah Gill: 27:43

Right, yeah. So what would you say are like your top two or three tips for women just wanting to have a VBAC in general, but especially a VBAC after multiple cesareans?

Petra Cruz: 27:55

Yeah. So birth processing, that to me is like number one. If you don't go back and think about your birth and I know it can be hard, because it was really hard for me, because I experienced very traumatic things and even though from the outside it might not have looked traumatic to others, it was very traumatic to me and so revisiting that was hard, I cried a lot. But you know, if you don't do that, then when you're in labor those same like fears or situations could pop up in your mind and it could, you know, slow your labor down or possibly even help you go back into that C-section room because you're so stuck on that. So birth processing number one and then, like number two, that fear, release whatever fear you're holding onto, release it, go through that fear, really, think about what could happen, like even the fear of, like tearing. Every mom almost that I talked to when they're thinking about giving birth vaginally is they're so scared to tear, which I get it.

Petra Cruz: 28:56

I was there too, like I was like I don't want to tear, I don't want to be different down there. But you know, literally go in, look up, you know what a tear could be like, how, what it takes to repair a tear, how long it could take to heal from a tear, and then you know, come back to that and be like, okay, well, maybe it's not as bad, you know, as I thought it was.

Petra Cruz: 29:20

So, go through every single one of those fears and, like me, I did tear. I had a second degree tear and honestly I would take a tear any day over having another C-section. It was not bad at all, Like the healing was beautiful, so and I was able to walk immediately, so it was perfect.

Petra Cruz: 29:39

So I mean, those are literally the top two things I would say. Third, and sometimes this feels like the most important thing, talk to your partner. Like, if you have a partner, talk to them about it, because I know I hear also like my partner's not on board with me having a VBAC or they think that it's dumb because we can schedule a C-section and we don't know when labor is going to come. If I go have a VBAC which I get it they don't understand completely what we're thinking. So talk to your partner about what you're feeling, what you're thinking going forward with having a VBAC, what that could look like, how you want them to support you during this, because if you don't talk about it, you know I do this too. I'm so guilty of this, but I just assume they know what I'm thinking. Yeah, but it's so far from the truth Like we got to just tell them just tell them.

Petra Cruz: 30:32

So those are the top three. Things like process your birth experience Number one fear release. Number two talk to your partner. So those are the top three, I would say.

Hannah Gill: 30:42

I love the tip to talk to your partner because we're in it, it's our birth, it's it's our experience. So we are doing this research and stuff and usually your partner is not like. They're like I don't know what you're talking about and they don't. They don't have the motivation behind it that that you do it's, it's complete. You're a completely different person. So I completely agree, like talking with them about it and, even if they're not necessarily supportive about it, just letting them know like this is my motivation behind it. This is my why this is what I'm going to do.

Hannah Gill: 31:13

I would love you to support me in this way and I know like one of the big reasons I've heard from people too, about why they choose to have a repeat C-section is because lack of partner support like forget, like lack of provider support, like having someone in your family, whether that be your partner or a family member not supporting you is, I think, so much harder because that's your personal life at home, like that's not your doctor. This is like at home, affecting you on a daily basis. So that is a huge struggle. So I think, especially talking to them way ahead of time, like if you're even thinking about having a VBAC or a certain type of birth, like talk to them before you even you're even pregnant, and try to get them to understand and educate them to the way you're educating yourself on everything that could potentially happen, like you said. You're saying yeah, absolutely.

Hannah Gill: 32:04

And then another thing I kind of wanted to comment on about what you said about like being able, not knowing when labor is going to happen with a view back, and being able to schedule a C-section. Because I hear this a lot and it's one of the main objections people say about like oh, I can just, you know, be induced, like schedule that induction or schedule my C-section. But I don't think people like fully, like think about that process because even if you have a scheduled C-section, say at 38, 39 weeks, whatever, you could go into preterm labor at like 35, 34 weeks or whatever. And then the whole point of like scheduling to, like control the schedule is like irrelevant because things can happen, like it's so unpredictable. So even with a scheduled C-section, like things can happen and you could still end up having a C-section at that point, but it's going to be four weeks earlier than you planned. So so much for having a schedule Like people don't think about that Exactly.

Petra Cruz: 33:00

Yeah, and I mean seriously. Your body can literally go into labor at any time, like we never know. So you can't really plan birth unless you I mean I don't know. None of us have a crystal ball, so really we can't.

Hannah Gill: 33:13

Yeah, yeah, there's no way to plan it Like and I know especially for women going for a VBAC and why they may choose a repeat C-section is like they want that sense of control. Like they want that sense of like, okay, I know, when I'm going to have my baby, I know I have control over this, because the VBAC is so like unknown and we don't know what's going to happen. But there's it's really like an illusion of control with scheduling a C-section because you still don't know what's going to happen. It just you can have the same sense of control over, like, making the decisions for your VBAC, like you said, like for your experience, you had the control because you just said, no, like I'm having this VBAC, I don't care what you say. So you can still have that sense of control with a VBAC versus having to schedule a repeat C-section.

Petra Cruz: 34:00

Yeah, absolutely. I think that's important to touch on too, because, yeah, none of us know what is going to happen in our birth, like there's so many unknowns. But you know, you have to really dig inside of yourself to try to be okay with that, feel okay with not knowing what's going to happen. To me, that was exciting. Like I was so excited like, ooh, maybe today's the day or, you know, I don't know, we don't get that really with much in this world. So to me, oh, I don't know, that's so exciting. And being able to just say no to like people's face and be like, no, this is my body, like my baby, that was so empowering to me too. Like oh my gosh.

Petra Cruz: 34:39

And then doing like having my VBAC in the hospital and literally like after I had my VBAC, nurses were bringing other nurses in and we're like this is a girl that had a VBAC after C-sections and I was just like, oh my gosh, like I felt like I don't know like a superstar or something. It was it was awesome yeah.

Hannah Gill: 35:00

That's so funny. You said that because, like for my, my birth too like people were just the hospital I birthed at, like they must not see a lot of unmedicated birth like, let alone like a VBAC but they were like shocked that like I gave birth on Medicaid.

Petra Cruz: 35:15

I'm like you guys don't see this every day.

Hannah Gill: 35:17

That's so weird. That's such a foreign, foreign thing. But yeah like having people that are just like so amazed with you, like especially a VBAC after three C-sections like that is a rare occurrence in a hospital, especially. So, I think that, like you were a superstar, you are a superstar.

Petra Cruz: 35:33

Oh, you're so sweet.

Hannah Gill: 35:35

Well, thank you, yeah, so where? So where can people find you? Like online, like your website, like what are you offering right now? Cause you don't know, petra is a doula, so where can people find you if they want to connect with you and hear more about your story and your journey, doula?

Petra Cruz: 35:49

So where can people find you if they want to connect with you and hear more about your story and your journey. Yeah, so in person, I do take birth clients, I do birth education. So I am in Modesto, california. My website is wwwbirthingcometruecom and my name is birthing come true almost on everything, because my birth came true like my dream birth came true. So it's kind of a play on that On Instagram. It's at birthing come true, and I actually have a podcast too. It's called the VBAC Junkie Podcast, which Hannah is going to be a guest on. Just saying so yeah, you can find me on any of those outlets and I actually am going to create like a VBAC education course, like birth education course for parents. So I'm really excited about that because obviously VBAC is like super near and dear to my heart and I want to help women in a way that feels good to them. So this is I don't know. I'm just so like incredibly excited about 2024 because it's going to be amazing.

Hannah Gill: 36:47

It is Like we've both manifested we're manifesting our 2024s.

Petra Cruz: 36:52

We've yes manifesting queens right here yes, I completely agree.

Hannah Gill: 36:58

Okay, so that's where you can find petra online. Thank you again, petra, for being here. I'm so excited to have you on and for everyone to be able to hear your amazing story.

Petra Cruz: 37:08

Thank you, and thank you for having me. It only took us, like I don't know, three months to schedule this.

Hannah Gill: 37:15

Working mom do the life.

Petra Cruz: 37:17

Yeah, exactly, All right. Well, thank you Hannah.

Hannah Gill: 37:20

Thank you. You just finished another episode of Motherhood Flow. For more, head over to thehannagillcom or on Instagram at thehannagill. As a reminder, this podcast is provided to you for educational and entertainment purposes only. It should not be considered a substitute for medical advice. Until next time, keep flowing.